Psycho-Pass Season 1 Episodes 21 and 22 Liveblog Chat Thingy!

Yes, after two weeks of last-minute and not-quite-last-minute cancelations, it’s finally happening!
How to participate in the liveblog chat:  Option 1: Whenever you watch the episode, comment on this post as you watch with whatever responses you feel like posting! Option 2: Go to Enter a nickname, then for the Channels field enter ##rabbitcube, and finally fill in the Captcha and hit Connect! We’ll be watching Psycho-Pass and commenting there starting at 2:00 p.m. EST.
I’ll update this post with the log after the chat.
ETA: Chatlog under the cut!

Episode 21
[14:15] <mere_oblivion> Inded
[14:15] <@Sylocat> The line between good diseases and bad diseases is a very blurry one after all
[14:15] <@Sylocat> (if they’re even discrete categories)
[14:16] <mere_oblivion> I got stuck back in ads–can we wait till I’m back?
[14:16] <@Sylocat> We’ll pause after OP
[14:16] <mere_oblivion> Thx
[14:16] <@Sylocat> What’s he reading from? I didn’t see the title
[14:17] <Froborr> The bible.
[14:17] <@Sylocat> Oh. I suppose that’s the ultimate classic for him to cite in the showdown
[14:17] <@Sylocat> (Urobuchi does love adapting Christian stories for his own themes, after all)
[14:17] <Arrlaari> I recall that Froborr had something to say about that particular quote last week
[14:17] <Froborr> IIRC, that’s the parable of wheat and chaff–usually interpreted as meaning that mortals lack the judgment/knowledge to predict who goes to heaven and who doesn’t.
[14:18] <@Sylocat> Paused at 3:11
[14:18] <Arrlaari> In that it is cited both in favor of and against mortal government
[14:18] <mere_oblivion> I’m a couple of minutes behind
[14:18] <@Sylocat> It did occur to me that this whole defoliant-virus thing seemed a bit out-of-left-field to be the showdown, maybe that’s the thematic connection?
[14:19] <Froborr> Yeah, I think so: how do you distinguish the “bad” plants from the “good”?
[14:20] <Froborr> Can you really trust the system doing it if it’s divorced from human judgment?
[14:20] <Arrlaari> Paused after ads
[14:20] <Froborr> Or if it’s one/some people’s judgment imposed on everyone else?
[14:20] <mere_oblivion> i’m near the end of ads, as far as i know
[14:20] <Froborr> Also paused after ads btw, think we’re waiting on mere.
[14:21] <mere_oblivion> Finally! Let’s, dare i say it, roll
[14:21] <@Sylocat> Okay…
[14:21] <@Sylocat> Click
[14:23] <@Sylocat> Heh, they really are making this more thematically coherent than I suspected
[14:24] <@Sylocat> Ah, at first I thought that was Makishima’s voice over the phone
[14:24] <@Sylocat> Prediction: Makishima is deliberately setting something up where they can only stop it by killing him
[14:26] <@Sylocat> “Falls short of 100%,” she has a gift for understatement
[14:27] <@Sylocat> Akane is good at this game
[14:27] <mere_oblivion> and getting better since she basically took over as leader
[14:28] <@Sylocat> …I’m reminded of my theory from way back that Akane was becoming asymptomatically criminal like Makishima
[14:28] <mere_oblivion> i remember that
[14:28] <mere_oblivion> not too shocking that he expected them to turn off the power
[14:29] <@Sylocat> I’m surprised they’re being this genre blind
[14:30] <Arrlaari> ad
[14:30] <@Sylocat> Paused at 11:58
[14:31] <Arrlaari> Tsunemori didn’t say so, but I’m confident she’s also thinking of where Kougami is going to look, and chose to put herself there.
[14:31] <@Sylocat> The fact that their plan involves having humans monitoring security cameras themselves ties in nicely with the theme of impersonal surveillance
[14:31] <mere_oblivion> Ready at 11:59
[14:33] <Arrlaari> paused after ad
[14:33] <@Sylocat> Okay then…
[14:33] <@Sylocat> Click
[14:34] <@Sylocat> This is an interesting callback to her backstory
[14:35] <@Sylocat> Akane’s playing eleventh-dimensional chess here
[14:36] <@Sylocat> Of course they’re doing this now, of all times…
[14:37] <Froborr> Makishima’s going to kill the dad Enforcer, isn’t he?
[14:38] <@Sylocat> What is that Makishima’s holding?
[14:39] <Froborr> Bomb of some sort. Pipe bomb?
[14:39] <@Sylocat> …That sounded nasty
[14:39] <Froborr> Oh, of course, and now the son will end up an Enforcer with a prosthetic arm.
[14:40] <@Sylocat> And so it comes full circle
[14:41] <Arrlaari> ad
[14:41] <@Sylocat> Paused at 19:22
[14:41] <@Sylocat> I’m now predicting Akane has to reveal that she’s got a custom weapon by stunning Ginoza as well
[14:42] <Arrlaari> If Ginoza was a threat, Makishima would have moved to kill him as well
[14:42] <mere_oblivion> Ready at 19:22
[14:43] <Froborr> I could see it happening if Ginoza gets ahold of Kogame’s gun.
[14:43] <@Sylocat> Makishima wants to make one or more of them kill him unlawfully (or at least try to) though.
[14:44] <Arrlaari> Paused after ad. I believe destroying Sybil is his highest priority – his interest in moving detectives to murder is something he only indulges if it’s compatible with that.
[14:45] <@Sylocat> I guess we’ll see. Okay then…
[14:45] <@Sylocat> Click
[14:45] <@Sylocat> What a comeback
[14:47] <Froborr> Yep, Ginoza’s getting that gun.
[14:48] <@Sylocat> No post-credits scene…
Episode 22
[14:53] <@Sylocat> What a perfect episode title
[14:54] <@Sylocat> I wonder if Makishima’s pulling a Martha Jones and was never even going to do the whole defoliant-virus thing
[14:54] <Arrlaari> ad
[14:54] <@Sylocat> Paused at exactly 3:00
[14:54] <Froborr> Paused after OP.
[14:54] <mere_oblivion> same here
[14:54] <Froborr> Interesting thought Sylo.
[14:55] <@Sylocat> It seems a bit… impersonal for him, in that it doesn’t have much to do with Sybil
[14:55] <Arrlaari> Makishima doesn’t strike me as one to go for the big bluff
[14:55] <Arrlaari> And we saw him turn on the equipment
[14:56] <Arrlaari> If the power hadn’t been cut, it likely would have deployed the famine virus without further intervention
[14:56] <@Sylocat> True… he’s surprisingly straightforward for this style of villain, which is the whole point of his character
[14:56] <Arrlaari> Paused after ad
[14:57] <@Sylocat> Okay…
[14:57] <@Sylocat> Click
[14:58] <@Sylocat> Don’t fall for that, Kogami
[14:58] <@Sylocat> …Was that Akane?
[14:58] <Froborr> Nice.
[14:59] <Froborr> Oh. Oh that’s good.
[14:59] <@Sylocat> …Whoa
[14:59] <@Sylocat> I should probably have anticipated this, but I didn’t!
[15:00] <@Sylocat> I doubt even Makishima will last very long with that would though…
[15:00] <@Sylocat> That’s a good line.
[15:00] <Froborr> It’s an authoritarian as fuck line.
[15:01] <@Sylocat> There’s a reason they say any law named after a person is a bad thing
[15:01] <Froborr> Okay, she’s modified it to basically emotivism, but she’s still equating morality and law in a disturbing way.
[15:02] <Froborr> Ouch.
[15:02] <@Sylocat> Jeez
[15:03] <@Sylocat> “Us?”
[15:04] <@Sylocat> Was anything in that truck, or did Makishima just grab the nearest vehicle and try to escape?
[15:04] <mere_oblivion> i assume the latter . . .
[15:06] <@Sylocat> …So he didn’t use the tweaked Dominator after all
[15:07] <Arrlaari> ad
[15:07] <@Sylocat> Paused at 13:08
[15:08] <mere_oblivion> Also there
[15:10] <Arrlaari> paused after ad
[15:10] <@Sylocat> A whole half-episode to wrap up the loose ends…
[15:10] <@Sylocat> Okay…
[15:10] <@Sylocat> Click
[15:10] <Froborr> That’s not uncommon for anime. Hell, FMA:B has an episode and a half.
[15:10] <@Sylocat> “Gee, thanks”
[15:12] <@Sylocat> If her Psycho-Pass is still unclouded after this, maybe she really is asymptomatic
[15:13] <@Sylocat> …Well.
[15:14] <Arrlaari> ad
[15:14] <@Sylocat> Paused at 16:48
[15:15] <mere_oblivion> Ready
[15:16] <Arrlaari> paused after ad
[15:16] <@Sylocat> Okay…
[15:16] <@Sylocat> Click
[15:18] <@Sylocat> They never got confirmation that Kagari got killed?
[15:18] <Froborr> Wait, who’s Kagari again?
[15:18] <@Sylocat> Kagari was that redheaded enforcer who got killed in the basement
[15:19] <Arrlaari> The kid Sybil executed in their room
[15:19] <Froborr> Oh! Right.
[15:19] <@Sylocat> Ahahah
[15:20] <@Sylocat> …We have confirmation
[15:20] <Froborr> It wasn’t exactly subtle before…
[15:20] <@Sylocat> Ah, it really is a full-circle ending
[15:23] <@Sylocat> Was that Kogami at the end?
[15:23] <Froborr> Interesting.
[15:23] <Froborr> Yes–round window implies he’s on a ship?
[15:26] <@Sylocat> …Sequel hook, I guess
[15:29] <@Sylocat> WEll, that was intense
[15:31] <@Sylocat> I didn’t quite follow what the dynamic was between Akane and Sybil at the end there
[15:32] <Froborr> Sybil recognizes that Akane hates them but feels dutybound to serve the law.
[15:32] <Froborr> They are treating her as an experiment: if they can make her accept them, then that is useful data for making the world accept them.
[15:32] <mere_oblivion> But what did Sybil mean by saying Akane’s “freedom of action” would be guaranteed?
[15:32] <Froborr> They won’t imprison her.
[15:32] <mere_oblivion> no matter what she does?
[15:33] <Arrlaari> Neither will they pull strings to demote her to Enforcer or apply special conditions to her work
[15:33] <@Sylocat> I suppose they can promise that since they (think they) know what she’s going to do at all times
[15:33] <Froborr> I read it as less a promise than a threat: “As long as you behave, we won’t screw you over or kill you.”
[15:33] <mere_oblivion> Okay, that makes sense (by their standards, i mean)
[15:37] <Arrlaari> Did anyone else recognize the new Inspector at the end?
[15:37] <@Sylocat> I think she’s a brand-new character? I thought she might be one of Akane’s friends, but Akane didn’t know her
[15:38] <Arrlaari> I’m pretty sure she is the other one of the two people Akane would have meals with – the other one, of course, was murdered by Makishima.
[15:38] <@Sylocat> It’d be a pretty neat continuity trick if she was some minor character from a one-off episode we’d forgotten about though
[15:39] <@Sylocat> Ah… if she was, maybe she was just introducing herself as a formality?
[15:39] <@Sylocat> I should go back and check at some point
[15:42] <mere_oblivion> Didn’t they refer to her as “a minor”–“it’s unusual for us to hire a minor” or something?
[15:42] <@Sylocat> Hmm? I missed that
[15:42] <Froborr> She WAS in a past episode!
[15:43] <@Sylocat> Oh?
[15:43] <Froborr> She was another student at that school, the one with the girl disguising corpses as art?
[15:43] <mere_oblivion> Amazing
[15:43] <@Sylocat> Hah! Wow, that’s good!
[15:43] <Froborr> She was the only student who suspected the killer.
[15:44] <mere_oblivion> In the “2 months later” scene, when the two of them were driving around, Akana says something like “We don’t usually hire a minor”
[15:44] <mere_oblivion> *Akane*
[15:44] <mere_oblivion> How did you figure that out, Froborr??
[15:45] <Froborr> I googled a cast list.
[15:45] <@Sylocat> I looked up the wiki too just now
[15:45] <Froborr> That gave me the character’s name, which I then looked up on the wiki.
[15:45] <mere_oblivion> man, that was quick
[15:45] <Arrlaari> And that explains the lines even better than my guess
[15:45] <Froborr> My google-fu is strong. 😉
[15:51] <Froborr> Any more comments before I post up?
[15:51] <mere_oblivion> what next, what now, what ho?
[15:51] <Arrlaari> yes
[15:51] <@Sylocat> One thing I’ve meant to bring up for a while…
[15:52] <Arrlaari> I have more to say
[15:52] <@Sylocat> …Go ahead, Arrlaari
[15:53] <Arrlaari> I’ve mentioned before that Urobuchi appears to be afraid that utilitarianism is correct
[15:54] <Arrlaari> From Akane’s argument to Kougami and some lines in Rebellion, I suspect he also has an unquestioned – or perhaps unquestionable – affinity for the idea of the Order of Things
[15:56] <Arrlaari> In both Psycho-Pass and Madoka Magica, the centrally horrifying revelation is “the Order of Things requires you to suffer” and it’s cast as horrifying because one cannot simply overturn Order
[15:58] <Arrlaari> If you’re Froborr and naturally expect Revolutionizing the World to be a worthwhile thing to do, Sybil and Kyubey aren’t going to be as dreadful to you as they evidently are to Urobuchi
[15:58] <mere_oblivion> I think that philosophy/state-of-mind is common among a certain set of extremely intelligent people–it’s not that far from the whole Ayn Rand shtick, and i’m often surprised at how (at least apparently) intelligent some Objectivists are
[15:59] <mere_oblivion> That’s in response to Aalaari from 2 entries ago
[15:59] <Froborr> I mean, I think Sybil and Kyubey are pretty dreadful, I just think their overthrow is an obvious response.
[15:59] <mere_oblivion> to Aarlaari at 14:54 and 14:56
[16:00] <mere_oblivion> I agree with you on that, Froborr, but Urobuchi seems at least partly resigned to the idea that Sybil/Kyubey are so powerful they can’t be overthrown
[16:01] <Froborr> Yeah, makes sense.
[16:03] <Arrlaari> It’s far less that than the idea that overthrowing them could be worse. It’s the dillema that gets to Urobuchi, a dillema that we don’t experience because chaos is good, actually.
[16:03] <Arrlaari> Note that what Akane promises, and Madoka achieves, is replacement of the horror-Order with a not-horrifying order
[16:04] <Froborr> Though the not-horror of Madoka’s order is debatable.
[16:04] <Froborr> But yes, I see what you’re saying.
[16:05] <Froborr> And yes, that’s definitely Akane’s central dilemma at least, that she is as much or more afraid of the chaos unleashed by exposing Sibyl as the continued existence of Sibyl.
[16:06] <mere_oblivion> Right! Though she also has faith that “people always want to build a better society,” which even i think is debatable
[16:08] <Froborr> I dunno, I think that’s actually true for most people.
[16:09] <@Sylocat> Oh, I don’t think it’s an incorrect line, it’s just that too many people define “better society” as “a society where people I like are in charge and people I don’t like suffer”
[16:09] <Froborr> Yeah.
[16:10] <Froborr> It’s AMAZING how hard it is to get people to agree with a statement like “we should minimize unnecessary suffering” as soon as stuff like criminal justice comes up.
[16:14] <@Sylocat> On that note, I think a lot of marginalized people wouldn’t be all that horrified by the prospect of a society where the cops are physically incapable of harming you unless a literal mind-reader verifies that you are an active threat to others
[16:15] <Froborr> Very true.
[16:17] <Arrlaari> I said very early, that it would be just like Urobuchi to write a dystopia and think of it as a better society than what we have
[16:17] <Froborr> I remember, and it is indeed just like him.
[16:23] <Froborr> So. Other comments?
[16:23] <@Sylocat> Ah yes, that thing I meant to bring up a few episodes back
[16:24] <@Sylocat> I think one reason I didn’t foresee the “Sybil’s true form” twist was because I’m one of those weirdos who doesn’t see a fundamental difference between wetware and silicon, so for me it wasn’t a game-changer in itself
[16:25] <@Sylocat> to learn that Sybil was made up of interconnected human brains rather than metal, I mean
[16:25] <Arrlaari> I think the crucial fact is not the brains, but whose brains
[16:26] <@Sylocat> Exactly
[16:26] <Froborr> Well, and that there’s a “who” that they’re frm at all.
[16:27] <Arrlaari> On the other hand, characters in the story believe it’s a huge deal that Sybil is a group of people and not a machine
[16:27] <mere_oblivion> Well, I have to hit the road. Amazing series (no surprise there). “See” you all again very soon, I hope. (Next Saturday??)
[16:27] <Froborr> Next Saturday is good for me!
[16:28] <Arrlaari> So am I really going to carry the next show selection by being the only voter?
[16:28] <@Sylocat> So, how did the vote come out for the next series? Dragon Maid, right?
[16:28] <@Sylocat> Hahah… I guess so. I’m fine with either
[16:29] <Froborr> Yep, looks like Kobayashi
[16:29] <mere_oblivion> Same here. See you then!
[16:29] <@Sylocat> (maybe one after the other?)
[16:29] == Sylocat changed the topic of ##rabbitcube to: Welcome to Rabbit Cube! Current weekly liveblog(s): Miss Kobayashi’s Dragon Maid
[16:31] <@Sylocat> Welp, I guess I’ll be off too… thanks y’all. It was exhausting but fun
[16:32] <Froborr> Yep!

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